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Policeman beheaded and son has heart/skin removed while alive
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2018-02-14 at 4:01 PM UTC
Originally posted by mmQ I can't be anything I want to be according to you. :(
Also isn't that common sense? Of course my beliefs are caused from outside influence. The difference is I equate them to still being mine, personal to me, unique and attributed to the brain and person of who I am.
But we're really not just one person now are we?
The body you inhabit is a cocktail of individual personalities that influenced you in your life either via memes or actions.
We are actually one single body that inhabits several thousand traits from the people we surround ourselves with in our life, the people we watch on tv, pc, etc.
This could make it complicated to assign guilt, because if a kid grows up in a criminal environment odds are he will become a criminal himself. Is he really responsible for that outcome though?
We have free will to some extent. We can pick our route which will be partially influenced by earlier events in life, but we cannot select which maze to be born into. -
2018-02-14 at 4:46 PM UTCYou can't even pick what thought you will think next. How could you choose your next action? Whatever "route" you end up going down was never something you freely chose.
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2018-02-14 at 4:57 PM UTC
Originally posted by Open Your Mind You can't even pick what thought you will think next. How could you choose your next action? Whatever "route" you end up going down was never something you freely chose.
I choose to reply to this, i could have chosen not to regardless of previous experiences.
To demonstrate this further, i will chose not to reply to your next comment or will i?
If you can't see the difference between choosing to born and choosing which icecream you want you're doing it wrong. -
2018-02-14 at 7:13 PM UTCWhatever events caused you to reply were events you did not intend and were not aware of and had no influence over. You had no choice.
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2018-02-14 at 7:22 PM UTC
Originally posted by Open Your Mind Whatever events caused you to reply were events you did not intend and were not aware of and had no influence over. You had no choice.
Again, you're saying nothing is ever free will except for the very first action that ever took place. That's all fine and well except it doesn't mean anything. As long as everyone feels their conscience and feels their decisions, it's as good as free will for all practical purposes. -
2018-02-14 at 7:30 PM UTC
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2018-02-14 at 11:23 PM UTC
Originally posted by mmQ Again, you're saying nothing is ever free will except for the very first action that ever took place. That's all fine and well except it doesn't mean anything. As long as everyone feels their conscience and feels their decisions, it's as good as free will for all practical purposes.
No I'm saying those feels that people have, the feeling that they could have acted differently in the past than they did, the feeling that they are the conscious source of their thoughts and actions, I'm saying that feeling is an illusion. I don't know anything about "the first action" or anything like that, all I'm saying is that feeling people experience and describe as "free will" is an illusion. And the science backs it up. You don't have to believe that if you don't want to, facts are facts whether you believe them or not. -
2018-02-15 at 12:33 AM UTC
Originally posted by Open Your Mind No I'm saying those feels that people have, the feeling that they could have acted differently in the past than they did, the feeling that they are the conscious source of their thoughts and actions, I'm saying that feeling is an illusion. I don't know anything about "the first action" or anything like that, all I'm saying is that feeling people experience and describe as "free will" is an illusion. And the science backs it up. You don't have to believe that if you don't want to, facts are facts whether you believe them or not.
You still look both ways before crossing a street. -
2018-02-15 at 12:48 AM UTC
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2018-02-15 at 12:54 AM UTCWell I don't believe in predeterminism but I believe in determinism. I also believe free will can coexist with that, and it's not until after we make that free choice that we can look back and see it's determinism.
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2018-02-15 at 12:56 AM UTC
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2018-02-15 at 12:59 AM UTC
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2018-02-15 at 1 AM UTC
Originally posted by Xlite But we're really not just one person now are we?
The body you inhabit is a cocktail of individual personalities that influenced you in your life either via memes or actions.
We are actually one single body that inhabits several thousand traits from the people we surround ourselves with in our life, the people we watch on tv, pc, etc.
This could make it complicated to assign guilt, because if a kid grows up in a criminal environment odds are he will become a criminal himself. Is he really responsible for that outcome though?
We have free will to some extent. We can pick our route which will be partially influenced by earlier events in life, but we cannot select which maze to be born into.
yeah tell that to the poor Mexican teen stripped of his skin by the fat Boss man.
"Hey we're one" -
2018-02-15 at 1:02 AM UTC
Originally posted by Open Your Mind You can't even pick what thought you will think next. How could you choose your next action? Whatever "route" you end up going down was never something you freely chose.
Which is odd.. because, do you ever have a dream where you wake up and think.. How in the fuck did I even have this. it's like a film. and words you would never use nor know the actual meaning, look it up and ask yourself "How in the fuck did I even know what that word meant" (sometimes in a different language and you knew the meaning)
you learned it once and put it far away? -
2018-02-15 at 1:03 AM UTC
Originally posted by Totse 2001 Which is odd.. because, do you ever have a dream where you wake up and think.. How in the fuck did I even have this. it's like a film. and words you would never use nor know the actual meaning, look it up and ask yourself "How in the fuck did I even know what that word meant" (sometimes in a different language and you knew the meaning)
you learned it once and put it far away?
Yes. It is called the unconscious. -
2018-02-15 at 2:35 AM UTCIt's because in the world of dreams, everything becomes linked, in a way. You're closer to the truth about the real reality, which lies just beyond this curtain we like to call reality.
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2018-02-15 at 9:23 AM UTC
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2018-02-15 at 11:19 AM UTCWe have self cognition unlike animals and plants.
Humans not only know, but we know that we know. We are able to monitor the process of our own thinking and maintain an awareness of it. Moreover, we can conduct a comparative assessment, evaluating the functioning of our thought processes against various "objective" standards we have adopted.
Being aware is the difference, being aware gives you free will. -
2018-02-15 at 12:43 PM UTC
Originally posted by Xlite Being aware is the difference, being aware gives you free will.
Unless your awareness is magical and somehow works outside of cause and effect it does not give you free will. And the science backs this up. Researchers are able to accurately predict a persons choice before the person is even consciously aware they have made a decision. Either our wills are the result of prior causes and we are not responsible for them our our wills are random and we are not responsible for them... there is no room for free will. -
2018-02-15 at 1:14 PM UTC
Originally posted by Open Your Mind Unless your awareness is magical and somehow works outside of cause and effect it does not give you free will. And the science backs this up. Researchers are able to accurately predict a persons choice before the person is even consciously aware they have made a decision. Either our wills are the result of prior causes and we are not responsible for them our our wills are random and we are not responsible for them… there is no room for free will.
Prior causes influence our options within our free will. Such as a choose-your-own-adventure story. You choose adventure A and are then limited to a new specific set of adventures to then choose from. The choice is still yours. It's free will within set parameters, not holistic freedom, but will of choice still exists.
