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Boris Johnson Prime Minister
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2019-07-26 at 6:02 PM UTCPower legitimizes government. Nothing else. Might makes right. It has nothing to do with any kind of democracy or ability or worthiness or merits.
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2019-07-26 at 6:11 PM UTC
Originally posted by Jiggaboo_Johnson Any government in power is legitimate as long as the majority follow it's directives. The opinions of the few or observers are worthless unless they manage to overthrow said government.
Originally posted by -SpectraL Power legitimizes government. Nothing else. Might makes right. It has nothing to do with any kind of democracy or ability or worthiness or merits.
Both of you are mentally subnormal.
The question of legitimacy of government only comes because there is something to define as illegitimate: as John Locke aptly put it, legitimacy comes from the consent of the governed.
Even to apply political force, you need consent from your political power base. Why would they consent to your government in the first place? That just postpones the question one step back. -
2019-07-26 at 6:17 PM UTC
Originally posted by Common De-mominator Both of you are mentally subnormal.
The question of legitimacy of government only comes because there is something to define as illegitimate: as John Locke aptly put it, legitimacy comes from the consent of the governed.
Even to apply political force, you need consent from your political power base. Why would they consent to your government in the first place? That just postpones the question one step back.
You must be pretty naive and gullible. Either that, or just plain dishonest. -
2019-07-26 at 6:23 PM UTCThere isn't actually anything stopping the people of a country from deciding amongst themselves to all just ignore their current leaders, stop paying them taxes and not serving them in any way and then deciding on another leader to follow. If they did that then you immediately cease to be a governer and there would be nothing you could do about it.
Why do you think governments go to so much trouble preventing large politically themed gatherings. Why you think there are no websites online where every citizen of a country can go to discuss current political issues?
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2019-07-26 at 6:27 PM UTC
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2019-07-26 at 6:38 PM UTC
Originally posted by NARCassist There isn't actually anything stopping the people of a country from deciding amongst themselves to all just ignore their current leaders, stop paying them taxes and not serving them in any way and then deciding on another leader to follow. If they did that then you immediately cease to be a governer and there would be nothing you could do about it.
Why do you think governments go to so much trouble preventing large politically themed gatherings. Why you think there are no websites online where every citizen of a country can go to discuss current political issues?
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Exactly. The fact that people don't just switch their mandate comes prior to force. Why don't they do it for the UK govt but draw the line for the EU? What makes them preferable or more legitimate authorities than the EU?
The answer is obviously nothing: you just give them your mandate because you believe it will help you if you let them have X power. Nothing makes the UK govt any more legitimate than the EU, just whether or not you think granting them X power for Y benefit is acceptable.
And I've still not seen a single damn argument that there is any positive benefit to leaving the EU. The only argument presented thus far is that the people at 10 Downing Street somehow care more about you personally than people at the Hague... Because race or some shit. -
2019-07-26 at 6:49 PM UTC
Originally posted by Common De-mominator The answer is obviously nothing: you just give them your mandate because you believe it will help you if you let them have X power. Nothing makes the UK govt any more legitimate than the EU, just whether or not you think granting them X power for Y benefit is acceptable.
The UK is a Constitutional Monarchy with an unwritten constitution. There, Parliament's legitimacy flows from the Crown, who is appointed by God.
The European Commission, which is the leading organisation in the EU is a cabal of bureaucrats set up by a gang of jedis, which doesn't even pretend to have any legitimacy, besides in some vague enlightenment sense. -
2019-07-26 at 6:52 PM UTC
Originally posted by Common De-mominator ??? Wtf are you talking about nigger. The fact is that racial similarity has not ever, ever lead to anything like political unity or establish or legitimise any government. Otherwise shit like the god damn World Wars would not have happened.
world wars started specifically due to the conflict between people of different races. and do i need to remind you about troy and trojans.Of course you are going to further degrade the concept of race to justify these conflicts… and further argue my point that ultimately it just breaks down into individuals and there really is no inherent unifying principle that legitimises all governmental actions to every individual.
ok, you define what is race then.?? Whatt
Literally the only reason why international extradition treaties are a thing is because of how borders define political power… If they didn't, you could easily traipse across the border and just take back the fugitive.
no, the mere fact that one country had to obey and act according to the laws of another country and detain someone who broke the laws of that foreign country is proof enough that political powers of some country trancends the borders and are no longer defined by their borders.Sanctions only matter because of the political capital attached to the border. If tomorrow there was a democratic revolution in Iran and the people overthrew their government, it's highly unlikely the same sanctions that applied to that government will apply to the country under the new regime. Again, they are a feature of political power.
what border ? iranians and north koreans who had their monies parked in suisse suddenly found their accounts frozen at the behest of US government.
no borders involved.And as for economics, it is only political insofar as the government has the political power to enforce its laws within its borders. So for example, the reason why your economies are separate is because you have different currencies, different laws, can't trade without a separate level of governmental interjection that means you are operating in a very different economic sphere than me. The government's influence only matters to where it has political power.
politics are the extension of economics, so its the other way round.So for example, I don't want to have to I select my food for lead poisoning every time. I don't want botulism in my canned pineapples. I don't want contaminated medicine. I don't want to worry about it. So I buy into a social fabric where I give up my freedom to not have my products inspected by the government, in exchange for the benefit of living in a society where the products are inspected for safety by the government. This way I don't have to worry about lead poisoning. I can let the government take care of that. That consenting exchange is the basis of government's power (mandate). The economic impact the government has is… Political. The boundaries it defines economically are drawn along… Political lines.
real world doesnt work like that. again, in the real world, its the other way round. political boundries are drawn along economic lines.Ah yes, racial homogeneity solves everything, there is never any political violence after this and even if it's direct violence then surely someone of the same race as you must know what is best for you… No it ain't, shithead. Trying to tie governmental legitimacy to race doesn't work on any level, except the one where you twist semantics to the point where the words you are using don't mean shit.
no. all you need to do is just look back in history and youll see all stable governments were/are established along group identities and among the most common were/are along races, followed by religions.It was only after the slaves were freed that America became a unified, monocultural, monoracial country? Okay lmao.
no, i said america only became a unified country after the civil war. america was really a true white and cristian democracy for the first hundred years + after the civil war and it continued to be so until sometime after ww2.The United States is still not one nation. It never was. Neither is China, nor anywhere else.
america is one country, 50 systems, while china is one country 2 systems.Your race doesn't establish shit, ultimately it is someone who does not know jack shit about your situation making decisions for you. Under this framework of thought, no government is legitimate except the government of one, of yourself upon yourself.
your point ?Every aggregate group is just a spectrum of differences. All you're saying is that eventually every nation will subdivide into libertarianism with no room for any government. The fact that the government is of the same race as me doesn't mean jack shit regarding their authority over me.
it means they're more likely to be thinking the way you do and make laws that are more in line with your norms and cultural values, which makes you more likely to vote / support them.Yeah it's not like there was a deliberate 300 year long campaign to sow division by the British…
they cant sow any division if there werent any divides to begin with. divide and conqueer can only work on a population that are significantly different from each other in their most basic form.India and Pakistan themselves are massively ethnically diverse nations, particularly India, and along many more lines than in the broadest religions. Hindu sects still beat the fuck out of each other on the streets, and political violence still breaks out in voting districts outside of large city centers.
but the divide amongs hindus is not great enough to split them into different countries and the all stood behind indiaThe only people "speculating" this are brain dead mongs who get most of their information from 4chan. There will be no civil war or secession in the US, anyone who believes that has literally bought into memes as reality and needs to disconnect from the internet for a looooong time.
4chan is mental illness.
its not the possibility of civil war breaking out that i was trying to point out, but the factors that will trigger a civil war.
those factors mentioned WILL trigger a civil war if americans today are the same hard americans of the past.Ok. Maybe you should purify your nation to the point where there's only one person left, and their ideology is as pure as can be.
thats a great idea. i always wanted a sea stead.Who gives a fuck about races or cultures.
people with superior, pure races. unlike you.Governments are administrative conveniences. I don't want to get lead poisoning from my pipes, I want a body that can handle that for me. I do not give a motherfuck if that body is flavoured vanilla or neapolitan.
why did FAA let boeing self-sign their safety certificate ?That the point dipshit. Mao being Chinese has nothing to do with legitimising his reign: why should any Chinese accept Mao's dipshittery any more than a foreigner?
yes it did.If a more competent foreign administration made better decisions that weren't fueled by shit science… would you rather have Mao and his shit science killing millions just because he has slanty eyes like you?
yes. even kippling is aware of this. read his 'the stranger'.Melting down their farming tools for shit quality metal.
???The only measure by which the EU "imposes" these… Is by the terms of participation in the union. The reason why nations comply… Is because they want to remain in the union… Because it's good for them. It's not forcing anyone to do anything or removing their sovereignty whatsoever. The "force" is offering the benefits of the Union.
the same can be argued about forced technology transfer by china.
or króz's alleged rape. -
2019-07-26 at 7:08 PM UTC
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2019-07-26 at 7:40 PM UTCThe New World Order has its claws in the UK, France, Germany and Canada right now, but they're losing.The following users say it would be alright if the author of this post didn't die in a fire!
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2019-07-26 at 8:04 PM UTC
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2019-07-26 at 8:11 PM UTC
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2019-07-26 at 8:31 PM UTCSept 11th, 1991 (9/11)
Coincidence? Well, then you must be pretty stupid. -
2019-07-26 at 9:13 PM UTC
Originally posted by Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country The UK is a Constitutional Monarchy with an unwritten constitution. There, Parliament's legitimacy flows from the Crown, who is appointed by God.
The European Commission, which is the leading organisation in the EU is a cabal of bureaucrats set up by a gang of jedis, which doesn't even pretend to have any legitimacy, besides in some vague enlightenment sense.
No, the parliament's legitimacy comes from mandate. If tomorrow everyone in Britain decided they wanted to be Canada 2 now, the crown cannot do jack shit but suck its own fuck.
The EU has exactly as much legitimacy as the UK govt. -
2019-07-26 at 9:19 PM UTC
Originally posted by Common De-mominator No, the parliament's legitimacy comes from mandate. If tomorrow everyone in Britain decided they wanted to be Canada 2 now, the crown cannot do jack shit but suck its own fuck.
Then why does the Prime Minister visit the Queen to get appointed, dissolve and commence parliament, etc.The EU has exactly as much legitimacy as the UK govt.
The European Commission's only mandate comes indirectly, by appointment by politicians.The following users say it would be alright if the author of this post didn't die in a fire! -
2019-07-27 at 5:49 AM UTC
Originally posted by vindicktive vinny world wars started specifically due to the conflict between people of different races. and do i need to remind you about troy and trojans.
ok, you define what is race then.
no, the mere fact that one country had to obey and act according to the laws of another country and detain someone who broke the laws of that foreign country is proof enough that political powers of some country trancends the borders and are no longer defined by their borders.
what border ? iranians and north koreans who had their monies parked in suisse suddenly found their accounts frozen at the behest of US government.
no borders involved.
politics are the extension of economics, so its the other way round.
real world doesnt work like that. again, in the real world, its the other way round. political boundries are drawn along economic lines.
no. all you need to do is just look back in history and youll see all stable governments were/are established along group identities and among the most common were/are along races, followed by religions.
no, i said america only became a unified country after the civil war. america was really a true white and cristian democracy for the first hundred years + after the civil war and it continued to be so until sometime after ww2.
america is one country, 50 systems, while china is one country 2 systems.
your point ?
it means they're more likely to be thinking the way you do and make laws that are more in line with your norms and cultural values, which makes you more likely to vote / support them.
they cant sow any division if there werent any divides to begin with. divide and conqueer can only work on a population that are significantly different from each other in their most basic form.
but the divide amongs hindus is not great enough to split them into different countries and the all stood behind india
its not the possibility of civil war breaking out that i was trying to point out, but the factors that will trigger a civil war.
those factors mentioned WILL trigger a civil war if americans today are the same hard americans of the past.
thats a great idea. i always wanted a sea stead.
people with superior, pure races. unlike you.
why did FAA let boeing self-sign their safety certificate ?
yes it did.
yes. even kippling is aware of this. read his 'the stranger'.
???
the same can be argued about forced technology transfer by china.
or króz's alleged rape.
Man wtf even is this argument any more. I am not the on ewho brought race into it, race is fucking irrelevant to what makes one government more legitimate than the other, they equally know jack shit about you. Nothing in this entire post somehow argues it makes more sense to obey the UK govt than to obey the EU govt on any principle and non arbitrary level. -
2019-07-27 at 5:51 AM UTC
Originally posted by Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country Then why does the Prime Minister visit the Queen to get appointed, dissolve and commence parliament, etc.
Ceremony? What would happen if this stopped entirely tomorrow?The European Commission's only mandate comes indirectly, by appointment by politicians.
And... if I don't vote for the sitting UK government, what legitimises their authority over me? -
2019-07-27 at 10:33 AM UTC
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2019-07-27 at 11:06 AM UTC
Originally posted by Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country Then why does the Prime Minister visit the Queen to get appointed, dissolve and commence parliament, etc.
The European Commission's only mandate comes indirectly, by appointment by politicians.
the house of lords is no different, nobody voted them in either. and they get appointed for life and have the power to veto anything the elected officials in parliament put through. and yet people still think their vote means something, lol.
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2019-07-27 at 11:18 AM UTC
