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We have a moral obligation to stop eating meat
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2018-06-13 at 3:07 AM UTC
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2018-06-13 at 3:17 AM UTCThey should just rename google as Spectral
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2018-06-13 at 3:20 AM UTCPeople think something has to move before it's "alive" and "sentient", and yet a plant moves, just more slowly.
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2018-06-13 at 3:30 AM UTC
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2018-06-13 at 3:44 AM UTC
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2018-06-13 at 6:33 AM UTC
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2018-06-13 at 6:35 AM UTCthey obviously respond to structural damage so who's to say that that sensation isn't analogous to pain that manimals feel
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2018-06-13 at 6:48 AM UTC
Originally posted by benny vader western scientific superstition.
It's not "scientific superstition" because no entomologist has ever suggested insects don't have nervous systems. All insects have brains and a central nervous system.
Wether or not that nervous system is complex enough to produce sensation that could rightly be called pain isn't clear. -
2018-06-13 at 6:52 AM UTC
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2018-06-13 at 8:56 AM UTC"Insects lack the neurological structures that translate a negative stimulus into an emotional experience. We have pain receptors (nocireceptors) that send signals through our spinal cord and to our brain. Within the brain, the thalamus directs these pain signals to different areas for interpretation. The cortex catalogs the source of the pain and compares it to pain we've experienced before. The limbic system controls our emotional response to pain, making us cry or react in anger. Insects don't have these structures, suggesting they don't process physical stimuli emotionally."
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2018-06-13 at 1:49 PM UTC
Originally posted by -SpectraL "Insects lack the neurological structures that translate a negative stimulus into an emotional experience. We have pain receptors (nocireceptors) that send signals through our spinal cord and to our brain. Within the brain, the thalamus directs these pain signals to different areas for interpretation. The cortex catalogs the source of the pain and compares it to pain we've experienced before. The limbic system controls our emotional response to pain, making us cry or react in anger. Insects don't have these structures, suggesting they don't process physical stimuli emotionally."
"Suggests" is a pretty important word here. -
2018-06-13 at 1:54 PM UTCPlants react to physical harm as well
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2018-06-13 at 2:13 PM UTC
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2018-06-13 at 2:37 PM UTC
Originally posted by Kinks Plants react to physical harm as well
Plants are intelligent:
Originally posted by Obbe The word intelligence derives from the Latin intelegere; to choose between. In situations of choice if the decision made after assessment is beneficial, it is considered to be an intelligent decision. Legg and Hutter (2007) collected some 70 different definitions of intelligence and summarized them as follows. Intelligence: (i) Is a property that an individual has as it interacts with its environment or environments. (ii) Is related to the agents ability to succeed or profit with respect to some goal or objective. (iii) Depends on how able the agent is to adapt to different objectives or environments.
In the same numerical order. (i) Wild plants interact with and respond to their environment via competitive and other biotic and abiotic signals. (ii) The goal or objective is fitness with seed number as a fitness proxy. Those most successful, and thus most fit, provide more offspring. (iii) Fitness depends on the skill with which individuals best adapt to their environment throughout their life cycle (McNamara and Houston, 1996). Those individual plants that can master and adapt to the problems of competition, master other biotic and abiotic stresses with greater plasticity, lower cost, higher probability, or more rapidly, are fitter and on this basis are more intelligent. Finally intelligence is a capacity for problem solving, (the psychologists choice) and profiting from experience another (Jennings, 1923; Gardner, 1983; Sternberg and Detterman, 1986; Sternberg, 1986). All effectively say the same thing.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4845027/
But we still need to eat. -
2018-06-13 at 2:50 PM UTC
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2018-06-13 at 3:09 PM UTC
Originally posted by -SpectraL "Insects lack the neurological structures that translate a negative stimulus into an emotional experience. We have pain receptors (nocireceptors) that send signals through our spinal cord and to our brain. Within the brain, the thalamus directs these pain signals to different areas for interpretation. The cortex catalogs the source of the pain and compares it to pain we've experienced before. The limbic system controls our emotional response to pain, making us cry or react in anger. Insects don't have these structures, suggesting they don't process physical stimuli emotionally."
Shifting goalposts. First you claim insects have no central nervous system, now you're changing the story trying to talk about "neurological structures". I mean the latter is a fair argument to make, but it's one you've only backpedaled to after being called on your bullshit. -
2018-06-13 at 3:12 PM UTC
Originally posted by Lanny Shifting goalposts. First you claim insects have no central nervous system, now you're changing the story trying to talk about "neurological structures". I mean the latter is a fair argument to make, but it's one you've only backpedaled to after being called on your bullshit.
It's not backpedaling. I start with a basic premise, and if that premise is challenged, then I build on the premise. There's nothing wrong with that. Bugs do not have a central nervous system as we know it. -
2018-06-13 at 3:37 PM UTCI’ll outsurvive everyone here if we have to resort to starving after this thread
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2018-06-13 at 5:22 PM UTC
Originally posted by -SpectraL "Insects lack the neurological structures that translate a negative stimulus into an emotional experience. We have pain receptors (nocireceptors) that send signals through our spinal cord and to our brain.
''scientists'' cant even locate the pain receptors in our brain, they can not be trusted to be able to find in even smaller creatures such as insects.
and yeass, our brain can actually feel pain, which is why homosapiens of every culture around the world, of superior or inferior racial stock, of ubermenschen and untermenschen, of every color have a word for head-ache.
brain pain is real and we actually do have hitherto undiscovered pain receptors in our brain to recep the shit out of it. -
2018-06-13 at 6:05 PM UTC
Originally posted by benny vader brain pain is real and we actually do have hitherto undiscovered pain receptors in our brain to recep the shit out of it.
Inversely, you also have a brain in your stomach. Your "little brain", which consists of a network of neurons that line your stomach and your gut.
