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Military Genius Zelensky wants Ukrainians to throw molotovs at Russian tanks
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2023-09-28 at 4:44 PM UTC
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2023-09-28 at 6:24 PM UTC
Originally posted by vindicktive vinny they can always surrender
then the west pulls funding and everyone left either flees the country or eats each other.
when the Maidan happened, it forced a wedge between the East and West of the Ukraine - the main issue was that the West thought themselves European and wanted a cut of the Eurozone while the East refused because a condition of even considering an accession agreement was the total restructuring of the existing trade agreements with Russia, which they relied on. it was effectively an attempt to convert preferential trade agreements with Russia into preferential trade agreements with the EU.
the Eastern part of the Ukraine was the economic driver of the country, with minerals mining, agriculture and some manufacturing concentrated there. without it the country's economy would be a hollow shell, and they couldn't be allowed to continue with their Russian partnerships if the West were to create new ones with the EU. granting them autonomy under the Minsk Agreements would not work, so the only option was to force them into submission.
I don't know if the US and EU knew that this would eventually lead to confrontation with Russia and meant to use the Ukraine as a way to drain Russia militarily and economically or if they thought (like Sakaashvili) that Russia would not intervene, but the result ended up being the same - an unwinnable war and no future for the countryThe following users say it would be alright if the author of this post didn't die in a fire! -
2023-09-29 at 7:01 AM UTC
Originally posted by aldra then the west pulls funding and everyone left either flees the country or eats each other.
when the Maidan happened, it forced a wedge between the East and West of the Ukraine - the main issue was that the West thought themselves European and wanted a cut of the Eurozone while the East refused because a condition of even considering an accession agreement was the total restructuring of the existing trade agreements with Russia, which they relied on. it was effectively an attempt to convert preferential trade agreements with Russia into preferential trade agreements with the EU.
the Eastern part of the Ukraine was the economic driver of the country, with minerals mining, agriculture and some manufacturing concentrated there. without it the country's economy would be a hollow shell, and they couldn't be allowed to continue with their Russian partnerships if the West were to create new ones with the EU. granting them autonomy under the Minsk Agreements would not work, so the only option was to force them into submission.
I don't know if the US and EU knew that this would eventually lead to confrontation with Russia and meant to use the Ukraine as a way to drain Russia militarily and economically or if they thought (like Sakaashvili) that Russia would not intervene, but the result ended up being the same - an unwinnable war and no future for the country
contrary to what the media says western part of the ukraine is actually full of industrial and manufacturing bases, as evidenced by the choices of russian strike targets.
ukrainians are not going to die of starvation if they just surrender today because russian is not on a genocidal champaign against ukrainian speakers.
once the russains are sastified with the demilitarization and denazification the flow of food and other humantarian materials and energy will resume flowing in into the western parts.
the sooner the ukros surrender the better it will be for them and the sooner the reconstruction can start.
its not in the best interest of russia proper to have an unstable and starving neighbor, and nobody really wants ukrainian refugees unless they are preteens lolis. -
2023-09-29 at 10:46 AM UTC
Maidan Nezalezhnosti in Kiev always has protestors going on about something. And generally no one knows or cares, even the protestors. -
2023-09-29 at 11:06 AM UTC
Originally posted by vindicktive vinny contrary to what the media says western part of the ukraine is actually full of industrial and manufacturing bases, as evidenced by the choices of russian strike targets.
most of them are power infrastructure and weapons warehouses, there have been maintenance/repair workshops for armor and rotary aircraft (afaik all of the maintenance centres for the latter are gone) but they don't really translate to industrial-economic output after the war.
Originally posted by vindicktive vinny ukrainians are not going to die of starvation if they just surrender today because russian is not on a genocidal champaign against ukrainian speakers.
once the russains are sastified with the demilitarization and denazification the flow of food and other humantarian materials and energy will resume flowing in into the western parts.
their entire day-to-day existence relies on foreign assistance; if that were to disappear they'd be in an extremely dire situation. even if Russia were to fill the void and not be sabotaged it'd take time and suffering before the situation could be stabilisedThe following users say it would be alright if the author of this post didn't die in a fire! -
2023-09-29 at 11:54 AM UTCThe following users say it would be alright if the author of this post didn't die in a fire!
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2023-09-29 at 1:09 PM UTC
Originally posted by aldra most of them are power infrastructure and weapons warehouses, there have been maintenance/repair workshops for armor and rotary aircraft (afaik all of the maintenance centres for the latter are gone) but they don't really translate to industrial-economic output after the war.
i cant find english version but here they are. feel free to use yandex translate.
these are from 2006 i believe but you get the picture.their entire day-to-day existence relies on foreign assistance; if that were to disappear they'd be in an extremely dire situation. even if Russia were to fill the void and not be sabotaged it'd take time and suffering before the situation could be stabilised
nonsense.
their living condition and infrastructure in the western part is way better than most of the 3rd world country and some town in the US. the first thing that will happen as soon as the war stops is that investors will be pouring in, from europe, the US, russia and china due to ukraines proven track record of harboring large quantities of natural resources.
investors will be lining to get in like a bunch of negroe in heat hanging around a white woman. -
2023-09-29 at 1:10 PM UTC
Originally posted by Speedy Parker https://www.cujf.org/hec
thanks.
i did not know holocaust studies have been made mandatory by your folks. -
2023-09-29 at 1:13 PM UTC
Originally posted by aldra most of them are power infrastructure and weapons warehouses, there have been maintenance/repair workshops for armor and rotary aircraft (afaik all of the maintenance centres for the latter are gone) but they don't really translate to industrial-economic output after the war.
their entire day-to-day existence relies on foreign assistance; if that were to disappear they'd be in an extremely dire situation. even if Russia were to fill the void and not be sabotaged it'd take time and suffering before the situation could be stabilised
Europe will drop them like a bad habit. Germany would still be buying gas if the pipeline wasn't blown up. They will be like Moldova begging Russia and the EU to buy their stuff and going into starvation mode whenever their products get blocked.The following users say it would be alright if the author of this post didn't die in a fire! -
2023-09-29 at 1:55 PM UTC
Originally posted by vindicktive vinny i cant find english version but here they are. feel free to use yandex translate.
yeah but employees and income don't actually relate to production; I mean, on those maps Kiev's listed as having huge amounts of employees in and income from power generation, but none of the country's major NPPs and TPPs are anywhere near the capital.
the west's economy is primarily related to services and administration, and that sector would evaporate if they were to lose control of the actual factories, power stations, farmlands etc.
Originally posted by vindicktive vinny their living condition and infrastructure in the western part is way better than most of the 3rd world country and some town in the US. the first thing that will happen as soon as the war stops is that investors will be pouring in, from europe, the US, russia and china due to ukraines proven track record of harboring large quantities of natural resources.
investors will be lining to get in like a bunch of negroe in heat hanging around a white woman.
sure, but it's the same anywhere in the first world - managers and executives will always make more than workers, but if the workers disappear and can't be replaced, what the fuck are they going to do? mine their own coal?
it's also worth keeping in mind that they've lost nearly half their population through war deaths, people fleeing and losing the west of the country so there are a lot less mouths to feed -
2023-09-29 at 1:57 PM UTC
Originally posted by jerryb Europe will drop them like a bad habit. Germany would still be buying gas if the pipeline wasn't blown up. They will be like Moldova begging Russia and the EU to buy their stuff and going into starvation mode whenever their products get blocked.
I feel like Poland is kind of a bellwether in that regard; they were some of the most enthusiastic about arming and funding the Ukraine so long as they could benefit from it and now they're the first to rapidly drop them. much of the EU doesn't have any real sovereignty and just follows the 'Atlanticist' lead, but that's going to become untenable as their wealth and living standards fall -
2023-09-29 at 2:10 PM UTCIt’s funny because most polish people I know always hated Ukrainians. They call them dirty and shifty and stuff. This was before the war
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2023-09-29 at 2:15 PM UTCPoland has eagerly accepted goodies from Uncle Shekel and desires military bases there. They fixin to find out there is no thing as a free lunch. The US doesn't give you stuff because it likes you and wants to be your friend. And their bestest buddy the UK will back their play.The following users say it would be alright if the author of this post didn't die in a fire!
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2023-09-29 at 2:20 PM UTC
Originally posted by Fox It’s funny because most polish people I know always hated Ukrainians. They call them dirty and shifty and stuff. This was before the war
They don't like Russians either. If you read around on forums with a lot of Europeans you will see they also starting to dislike Ukrainians after they got a bunch of refugees. Especially when your keeping them up and you see a bunch of military age guys driving around in luxury cars trying to lord over the locals. -
2023-09-29 at 2:20 PM UTC
Originally posted by Fox It’s funny because most polish people I know always hated Ukrainians. They call them dirty and shifty and stuff. This was before the war
they chimped out on Poland in WWII, they still talk about the Volyna Massacre
if you're not familiar with Stepan Bandera, the 'nazi' idol of Ukrainian nationalists, you should read up on him a little
he raised the UPA to be a 'pro nazi' faction but he mostly just chimped out on whoever was convenient at the time. the nazis put him in jail for being a dangerous retard, multiple times if I remember rightThe following users say it would be alright if the author of this post didn't die in a fire! -
2023-09-29 at 2:32 PM UTCEuropeans have a different mindset than new worlders. Something happen 2-3 generations ago we just say fuck it that's history. Europeans will argue over who owned a small piece of dirt 500 years ago and butcher each other over it. See Balkans for good examples.
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2023-09-29 at 2:33 PM UTC'tis my field.
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2023-09-29 at 2:35 PM UTC
Originally posted by jerryb Europeans have a different mindset than new worlders. Something happen 2-3 generations ago we just say fuck it that's history. Europeans will argue over who owned a small piece of dirt 500 years ago and butcher each other over it. See Balkans for good examples.
They're alpha males were slaughtered for 2 generations in a row. That is what happened.The following users say it would be alright if the author of this post didn't die in a fire! -
2023-09-29 at 2:43 PM UTClol if the US was like Europe I'd be itching to get some pay back on them damn Yankees. We have lots of Yankees move here especially to retire because of low cost of living, some of us like fucking with them and call em damn Yankees. Both sides know the other just joking, Eurofags would be serious about it.
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2023-09-29 at 6:23 PM UTC
