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Occult General Discussion
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2016-02-07 at 10:24 PM UTCSup niggas, I am a bit of an occult expert and know quite a bit on the subject. Im making this thread to get a discussion going on the occult. I dont know what the interest level is here for something like this but I would bet its a reasonable interest. I will start with an intro to Chaos magic.
Chaos Magic intro:
There are many schools of magic, way to many to list here. The biggest modern followings are Chaos Magic, Thelmic Order of Golden Dawn and Satanist philosophies. Chaos magic gets a bad rap for being misunderstood. Basically its not so much about causing or creating chaos but rather causing or creating with chaotic means. The Chaos Magician is someone who does not use conventional means and rituals to do their work, or sometimes they will combine or mix conventional rituals into something new. The true Chaos magician is concerned with new and novel techniques and has little concern for dogmatic rituals as chosen by Golden Dawn. -
2016-02-07 at 10:56 PM UTCI do divinination.
I has this deck as you know. Noty that i believe in all this nonesense but it's bretty cool. -
2016-02-07 at 11:13 PM UTCI'm gonna start a cult called the OC cult thats obsessed with the occult so when we do a Jihadi sarin gas laptop airport bomb they go " the OC cult occult"
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2016-02-07 at 11:23 PM UTC
I do divinination.
I has this deck as you know. Noty that i believe in all this nonesense but it's bretty cool.
I remember when you did a reading for me. That was pretty cool. I havent got too much into tarrot to be honest but I have done quite a bit with the i Ching. I think its fascinating the way outcomes are determined using these types of systems. You should make a Reading thread or do readings in this thread. Twould be fun. -
2016-02-08 at 12:53 AM UTCI studied the occult for years, not that I really believe in any of it anymore (I did when I was younger). I mostly learned about Western magic but I wound up looking into some things from René Guénon on the recommendation of a fellow Totsean. I was actually watching a webinar on A. E. Waite before I saw this thread.
No offense kek, but it's a big red flag anytime someone announces themselves as a self-proclaimed expert in anything - especially something a pseudo-sceincy as the occult. Chaos Magic is particularly dubious since it originated in like the 1970s, since showing up so late to the scene is also a big red flag. I mean, let's be honest, Wicca is newer than Chaos magic, and that religion has almost completely been made up on the internet in the last twenty years.
As far as the occult is concerned, there's a lot to learn from it. I'm just typically not impressed by many of this flashier, newer stuff as a lot of it is just people posturing as authorities while making unsubstantiated claims. Just look at r/occul or basically any Open Source Order of the Golden Dawn or whatever other Masonic fraternity archetype you pick. The reality is that there's nobody out there who can demonstrate that any of this shit works beyond a basic psychological level. Nobody can impose their will on the laws of physics without honoring them. You can embrace philosophies and hypnotize yourself all you want, but the only changes you'll be making are on your attitude and perspective. Even so, these changes are usually never stronger than the placebo effect. It's not to say that these aren't powerful tools to expand your mind, but there's tons of stuff out there that does this already which doesn't require a person to go down a rabbit hole of mental gymnastics and citation chasing.
Honestly, most of the shit I've read is just hyperbolic language that tries to trump up adjusting your attitude or changing your perspective. This can be done without all the auspices. -
2016-02-08 at 8:23 AM UTCWhat I've observed is the tendency for those interested in the occult to generate explanation and to seek means of translating their intentions into external validation, when the idea of magic is really based upon internal gestures. I think this will become increasingly apparent through time in a way that parallels technological advancement and by no coincidence. The final frontier is the mind, and science will take us deeper in if we can maturely choose to emphasize the subjective.
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2016-02-08 at 8:47 AM UTCare you white-enochian? if so I download stuff from your site every now and again, it's an interesting read but I've never really gotten anything concrete or practical from it.
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2016-02-09 at 1:25 AM UTC
What I've observed is the tendency for those interested in the occult to generate explanation and to seek means of translating their intentions into external validation, when the idea of magic is really based upon internal gestures. I think this will become increasingly apparent through time in a way that parallels technological advancement and by no coincidence. The final frontier is the mind, and science will take us deeper in if we can maturely choose to emphasize the subjective.
I think it depends on what kind of magic you're talking about. Remember, some of the oldest western magic (like the Kabbalah) have jedi origins.
I think you otherwise make a fair point, but that it's really only relevant to new occult. -
2016-02-09 at 2:37 AM UTC
No offense kek, but it's a big red flag anytime someone announces themselves as a self-proclaimed expert in anything - especially something a pseudo-sceincy as the occult. Chaos Magic is particularly dubious since it originated in like the 1970s, since showing up so late to the scene is also a big red flag. I mean, let's be honest, Wicca is newer than Chaos magic, and that religion has almost completely been made up on the internet in the last twenty years.
I quite understand this point but I would be far warrier of a self proclaimed expert in real feilds of study. I have extensive knowledge of the occult and magic systems because I get bored and like to play with my mind. What you seem to propose is that no one can be an expert in anything unless they have credentials. Well I dont have a Certificate from the Golden Dawn School of Magical Magic Shit nor can I conjure a demon that will appear near you and speak of my expert knowledge in the area. What I do have is hundreds of hours killing time reading esoteric material.
Now I dont believe in much of this hokey shit, nor do I take near any of it at face value. I view magic and the occult as an internal psycology (Think R.A. Wilsons prometheus rising) rather than some harry potter bullshit. -
2016-02-09 at 3:03 AM UTC
I quite understand this point but I would be far warrier of a self proclaimed expert in real feilds of study. I have extensive knowledge of the occult and magic systems because I get bored and like to play with my mind. What you seem to propose is that no one can be an expert in anything unless they have credentials. Well I dont have a Certificate from the Golden Dawn School of Magical Magic Shit nor can I conjure a demon that will appear near you and speak of my expert knowledge in the area. What I do have is hundreds of hours killing time reading esoteric material.
Now I dont believe in much of this hokey shit, nor do I take near any of it at face value. I view magic and the occult as an internal psycology (Think R.A. Wilsons prometheus rising) rather than some harry potter bullshit.
I'm not really so much advocating credentials because there are no reliable credentials in the occult. Sure, there's pats on the back from the Masons or Golden Dawn or other modern "secret" societies, but that's even more pathetic than being a self-proclaimed expert because you pretty much have to pay for them.
Even if there were meaningful bodies that bestowed credentials for mastering the occult, would you believe them? Think of it this way, the Hermeneutical Order of the Golden Dawn can set their own benchmarks for achievement up their own ranks, but they wouldn't speak for the intelligences or powers that their manipulating. If we pretend for a minute that these things were literally true, you could potentially wind up advancing through the ranks and digging yourself into a deeper hole.
At any rate, I don't disagree with your point. Like you and others here have already said, studying the occult is basically studying a really weird form of applied psychology. The only thing I want to impress upon people in this thread is that it originally started as genuinely real promises of conjuring demons and being able to impose your will on the physical world. There was a time where these things were almost universally believed to be true and a church in one form or another ruled the whole world. It wasn't until society reached a degree of enlightenment and basically grew up where most of the educated people put these silly notions to rest that the occult retired into a realm of philosophy. The thing is that people didn't want to abandon the auspices of having these kinds of power, so they basically exploited other people by getting them to believe they have it.
I mean, think about it, if you study the old texts they're filled with promises of endless power, knowledge, sex, wealth, and privilege. It's much later that you get these jackasses who want to hide behind the imagery of a "secret art" when they're really just using overly symbolic language to tell basic truths of the mind. Namely, you can hypnotize yourself, the placebo effect is real, there are basic lessons to be learned from tales like Faust, believing things gives them power in your mind, meditation allows your brain to do things it couldn't do before, you can cause yourself to see things that aren't really there, you can have realistic nightmares, and whatever else is floating around out there.
Not to piss on everyone's parade or anything but I basically grew out of it. Until there's a point where someone can demonstrate a testable supernatural phenomenon, you're going to learn way more just browsing recent publications on PsychInfo or PsychArticles. You definitely have way less crap to and word games to cut through. -
2016-02-09 at 3:16 AM UTCOh so you just came to this thread to post long diatribes about how you dont believe in it and think its an endless pursuit. Care to hold your mouth shut so those of us who actually DO want to talk about things that might simply be insane?
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2016-02-09 at 4:20 PM UTC
Oh so you just came to this thread to post long diatribes about how you dont believe in it and think its an endless pursuit. Care to hold your mouth shut so those of us who actually DO want to talk about things that might simply be insane?
I'm getting kind of tired of people on this site who think 17 sentences constitutes a long post - especially if you're trying to have a serious conversation about something that requires an assload of reading like the occult.
Also, if you read what I wrote, it's not like I just said "this is gay." I basically explained the history of how "Occult Science" turned into "Occult Philosophy," which is largely the point of A. E. Waite's introduction in The Book of Black Magic.
And just a note, that introduction is much longer than 20 sentences, but as a self-proclaimed expert I'm sure you already knew all of this. -
2016-02-11 at 12:10 PM UTC
I do divinination.
I has this deck as you know. Noty that i believe in all this nonesense but it's bretty cool.
I'm going to be making my own deck soon enough. ^__^ -
2016-02-11 at 3:14 PM UTC
I'm going to be making my own deck soon enough. ^__^
My prediction is that you'll eventually lose it in your FILTHY room. -
2016-02-14 at 11:43 PM UTC
I'm going to be making my own deck soon enough. ^__^
Kewl, lotsa work though 72 cards. How will you be making the graphics? -
2016-03-22 at 12:37 AM UTCi did a kundalini awakening once, and got attacked by a ukranian ghost
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2016-03-22 at 1:03 AM UTCI play the ∆ of illuminati
