2016-09-13 at 7:43 AM UTC
Okay, I've got to thinking about shit after a conversation I had with a couple people.
I've always felt like this in regards to friendships/relationships that if there is a reason you cannot be honest and open with those people, beyond some exceptional circumstances (you work for the CIA, involved in some criminal activities that could hurt not just you but them, etc.), that relationship is a false one used only to give you and them the illusion of something meaningful. This is especially true IMO if lying is involved.
People tend to withhold things for trust issues or simply because the other party would not accept them for that thing if they were aware of it. I think an example of this would be mental illness or drug use. IRL I've usually kept a pretty low number of friends for those reasons. I don't want to play pretend with people. If I like someone and have come to know them well enough and can trust them, I'm honest about my shit. It feels like a stupid game to be playing where X can't know this about me and Y can't know this about me. Now, sure, I see why people have relationships like this with people... They need them for some reason and it can be as base as needing companionship or as complex as using the relationship for profit/employment/information. I won't say I've never had a relationship like this for one reason or another but I struggle to maintain relationships like this. It makes me feel very off inside and I quickly retreat.
For sincere relationships, if people can't take me how I am than what's the point? I don't like hiding stuff from people I love and care about. I feel like a fraud trying to do that and also have something meaningful. The part the gets me the most is some people are convinced that this relationship they have with X is real and meaningful when if X knew certain things they'd judge and treat them differently or all out reject them. How the fuck is that not a false relationship? How can that be considered real?
This even goes with parents. Most of us have relationships with our parents to some degree, but when we are afraid to reveal something about ourselves to them at least on some level that is really important about ourselves (think mental illness as an easy and relateable example) how is this real? I understand playing charades with people who'd not understand certain things about you but why delude yourself into thinking its real or meaningful? Its not IMO.
I also believe the vast majority of relationships are fake in this world. Very few are genuine.
Discuss.
2016-09-13 at 9:27 AM UTC
What about the relationships you have with others that you feel to be genuine, yet perhaps there are things the other person has not and/or will not ever disclose to you? Does that nullify the sincerity of the relationship considering your lack of knowledge regarding these hidden truths, or does the relationship remain sincere (and feel sincere) considering you never knew of the secrets of the individual in your relationship. Sort of a... what momma don't know won't hurt her type deal. I mean, as far as I believe, everyone has their secrets and their shameful past experiences, and some of those simply need not be ever mentioned, no matter what level of relationship you might have with someone- some things are just better left unsaid, and I don't personally feel that devalues the relationship, while in fact it may very well strengthen that very relationship. I suppose it can get a little complex as it relates to the degree of the unknowns, but like I said, they are unknowns, so if you are experiencing something that feels genuine, those unknowns really don't fucking matter.
I don't think I worded that very well, or perhaps I don't even know what I'm trying to say. I think a 'real' relationship is one where despite the faults of one another, and perhaps even the lack of communication or time spent together, continues to remain a relationship due to one another's ability to appreciate the very existence of the other person, regardless of the choices they make or even the hurt that they may at times cause.
I also might have no clue as to what a REAL relationship even is, or what that means. Is it based on time? Caring for the other? Appreciation? I suppose it could be argued that every relationship you have with someone else is real, and at the same time every relationship you have with someone else is fake. Does it matter? What's your dad's e-mail address?
2016-09-13 at 11:31 AM UTC
I know what you mean by 'unknowns'. Also, perspective is very important here. Let's say, on my end I am 100% honest and truthful and my 'friend' here has completely fabricated who they are to me. I guess, until the point, if I ever find out, at least I perceive the friendship as real and legit. I'm sure not one human I know knows 100% of my past. There are things I forgot (like dude, I totally had amnesia on the fact that for about a year of my childhood I played the fucking bagpipes- seriously. Who knows this? Nobody currently living up until recently when I recalled this shit from go through an old HD with a friend of mine. My grandfather died around then and I was real fucked up over it is the only reason I can even think of for why I forgot such a odd detail of my childhood. I didn't hold out on telling anyone this. Its rather irrelevant other than to poke fun at. I'm not even saying that keeping details from friends or family is wrong and makes that relationship fake, but say, you as teenager did a shitload of B&Es, jacked people's purses, shoplifted, etc. and had a few embarrassing, regretful and shameful acts involved besides the broad streak of your criminal activities. Now, with your friend you completely refrain telling them ANYTHING regarding your past as far as your criminality goes... I don't know, but if I had that sort of life (I'm not talking one isolated incident here either, we are assuming this is who you were for a time), I wouldn't consider my friendship to be real if disclosing that I did bad things in a part of my life would cause the relationship to end or change significantly- not saying every dirty thing you've ever done would need to be expressed. Now... That unknown area is a grey one too, but I think its even worse when you are actively engaging in things you withhold from a friend because it would ruin the relationship. Like, let's say you're still that guy who commits B&Es. Its understandable that you'd probably not have many friends if they knew (or weren't involved in things of that nature), so do you consider a situation like that a real friendship? Or lying.. How about telling this person lies to hide facts about yourself or situation? Is it a real relationship based on genuine love and care if a guy is lying to his girlfriend to go fuck a guy? How could that ever be considered real. Or lying about anything really. I think lies hurt people more than anything.. Even little well meaning lies. I'd rather be hurt by a truth than deceived by a lie. The point is I feel that if a person knows me and who I really am... If they don't accept me how I am, than really are they my friend and is it a legitimate relationship? Like parents who turn to hating their kid for being gay and reject them.. How is that a real relationship with those same parents just being kept in the closet and lied to? They are loving their child for being the child they want in appearance, not the child they have in reality. That's more where I am coming from with that. Would I continue a relationship with a person who would treat me differently in a negative way if they knew I had sex with a woman once in my life? No.. If that information, regardless of the rest of who I am would change things, then what's the point of having this friendship unless I'm wanting to continue it for other reasons, but I wouldn't feel its sincere or genuine. I just think a lot of us do a good job in deluding ourselves into believing there is more to something than there is. We will lie to this friend so they don't reject us or even so we dont hurt them.. Maybe we want to have a real relationship with them but just don't allow ourselves to for fear. Fear controls us so much this way. Idk about time.. I don't think time is really important, but I do think the longer a person goes hiding things about them the more into the fake it ventures.. Much more so if it involves outright lying. I'm extremely sleep deprived. Meh.. I just think we build in a lot of illusions with people. We have a way of pretending we are closer than we really are.
2016-09-13 at 1:04 PM UTC
Hydro, unless you have a sister or a female relative, you will never have a real friend.
Women can never be true friends with each other. They just use each other to gossip and use each other for social situations. A great example is a hot chick becoming "friends" with a fat chick. She's using you to look better. It's disgusting.
You can't be friends with a guy. I don't just mean because there will always be a sexual thing between you (I don't believe for a second you're attractive), but guys just cannot be "real" friends with girls. The same type of friend that guys are with other guys.
It's why women abandon their friends when they fall in love -- because they realize that's what true friendship is like. That's why when guys fall in love, they still hang out with their bros, because it isn't anything new to them (excluding the romantic side obviously). Unfortunately, because you're a fat disgusting whore, no guy will ever be in love with you.
And thus, you will never know true friendship.
Ever.
2017-09-04 at 10:19 AM UTC
you can never tell anybody everything tho, we all have secrets, every single one of us. it doesn't mean you can't have friends just because you don't open your cupboard up to them or visa versa. fake friendships are the ones where one of you are deliberately using the other or are being disloyal in some way. loyalty and respect are what makes a friendship.
.
2017-09-04 at 10:55 AM UTC
Originally posted by NARCassist
i don't have any
.
I know they're in there somewhere!
The following users say it would be alright if the author of this
post didn't die in a fire!
2017-09-04 at 11:01 AM UTC
All relationships are built on withholding information, the gulf between humans is fundamentally unbridgeable. It's not reasonable to expect absolute honesty without omission from a person nor should you want it. It would be fucking horrible to know everything about someone else.
2017-09-04 at 11:13 AM UTC
honesty when its something that concerns the friend is sufficient.
.
2017-09-04 at 11:18 AM UTC
there's a really shitty vince vaugn movie called the dilema. in the movie him and his pal run a start-up together which is at a crucial make or break point. his pal is the brains of the operation and any distraction at this point would see the business fail and they would both be ruined. but then he discovers his pals wife is cheating. so what does he do? tell him and financially ruin him? or say nothing until the crucial deal is settled? he's a pretty shitty friend whichever he chooses.
.
2017-09-04 at 7:35 PM UTC
(((lannys biggest secret)))
2017-09-04 at 11:14 PM UTC
this thread has so much tl;dr
2017-09-07 at 2:17 AM UTC
I want someone to know everything about me,
But that'll never happen
Post last edited by Wick Sweat at 2017-09-07T02:21:42.564958+00:00
