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Bundy Farm Standoff Redux
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2021-06-15 at 5:41 PM UTChttps://www.rt.com/russia/official-word/526594-oregon-water-protests-farmers/
Farmers are protesting because they own the water in the Upper Klamath Lake, farmer Dan Nielsen told RT’s Ruptly video agency. He stood outside an American flag-colored tent that was set up next to the canal headgates, which control the flow of irrigation water from the lake.
“It’s ours and the federal government actually just stole it. No due process of law, no compensation,” Nielsen said, adding that federal officials had violated the locals’ property rights guaranteed by the US Constitution.
Basically a group of farmers in Oregon own land surrounding a lake they use for irrigation, but due to a drought the state government has shut the canal. They appear to be claiming that the water level is low enough that further draining it threatens an endangered species of salmon in there and would put local native American populations relying on it for drinking water at risk.
The farmers are claiming they have the support of local militias and are threatening to reopen the canal by force.The following users say it would be alright if the author of this post didn't die in a fire! -
2021-06-15 at 5:48 PM UTCStop the TREAD
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2021-06-15 at 5:49 PM UTCGood. Bust the levey. Trumps department of the interior did everything it could to restrict individual ptoperty rights under either Scott Pruitt or Steve Minuchin, can't remember. This is a test for Biden that he will most likely fail. The government always seems to say that in theory you own your land unless they can say there are resources on it, then it becomes in their interest to take from you and what constitutes a useful resource to the state is whatever they deem it to be. I hope this ends the right way
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2021-06-15 at 5:57 PM UTC
Originally posted by Sudo Good. Bust the levey. Trumps department of the interior did everything it could to restrict individual ptoperty rights under either Scott Pruitt or Steve Minuchin, can't remember. This is a test for Biden that he will most likely fail. The government always seems to say that in theory you own your land unless they can say there are resources on it, then it becomes in their interest to take from you and what constitutes a useful resource to the state is whatever they deem it to be. I hope this ends the right way
I'm not sure, I need to read more about it - at least in this case it looks like more than just the farmers rely on it, and all that article says is that they claim they own it; it may only be partial ownership -
2021-06-15 at 5:59 PM UTC
Originally posted by aldra https://www.rt.com/russia/official-word/526594-oregon-water-protests-farmers/
Basically a group of farmers in Oregon own land surrounding a lake they use for irrigation, but due to a drought the state government has shut the canal. They appear to be claiming that the water level is low enough that further draining it threatens an endangered species of salmon in there and would put local native American populations relying on it for drinking water at risk.
The farmers are claiming they have the support of local militias and are threatening to reopen the canal by force.
these farmers are no less evil than the government thats seizing "their" water.
american mechanized farming practises are inefficient and consume excessive amount of water. -
2021-06-25 at 12:50 PM UTC
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2021-06-25 at 12:53 PM UTC
Originally posted by vindicktive vinny these farmers are no less evil than the government thats seizing "their" water.
american mechanized farming practises are inefficient and consume excessive amount of water.
not even just water - modern mechanised farming practices use around 10x the energy (in fuel combustion) they produce (in food), it's an absurd situation -
2021-06-25 at 12:58 PM UTCFirst Law of Thermodynamics: Energy can be changed from one form to another, but it cannot be created or destroyed
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2021-06-25 at 1:15 PM UTC
Originally posted by vindicktive vinny these farmers are no less evil than the government thats seizing "their" water.
If you give these farmers in regions where water is scarce the room they will empty the rivers, the lakes, the aquifers, everything, leaving no water for anyone or anything else.
I'd probably do the same thing, fuck those assholes down-stream from me.
It's basically a tragedy-of-the-commons type scenario.
This is precisely why you can't have absolute property rights, and why good governance is needed. We need to conserve natural resources. -
2021-06-25 at 1:38 PM UTCYou guys insisted on getting rid of slavery...that labor has to be replaced by something...and it has been, by energy and water guzzling machines and practices.
...the solution here is simple... -
2021-06-25 at 1:42 PM UTC
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2021-06-25 at 1:55 PM UTC
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2021-06-25 at 1:59 PM UTC
Originally posted by Donald Trump If you give these farmers in regions where water is scarce the room they will empty the rivers, the lakes, the aquifers, everything, leaving no water for anyone or anything else.
I'd probably do the same thing, fuck those assholes down-stream from me.
It's basically a tragedy-of-the-commons type scenario.
This is precisely why you can't have absolute property rights, and why good governance is needed. We need to conserve natural resources.
Ah yes, the other game theory -
2021-06-25 at 2:19 PM UTC
Originally posted by Jiggaboo_Johnson The Hydrological Cycle: water Is neither created nor destroyed, It Is merely transformed.
We all know native Americans drink cheap whiskey, not water.
water is created from hydrogen, it is 66% hydrogen, and 34% hydrogen derivative.
and no, we arent discussing the genesis of water here.
we are talking about the adequatcy of water for everyones consumption.
when farmers irrigate their farm, they are actually going against the order of nature by forcing plants to grow where nature refused to let them grow. and they do so by robbing water supply from places and organisms nature intended them to live.
and the second imbalance caused by modern mechanized farming is that it sustain organisms that wouldnt have otherwise survived due to their inferiority and incompetency at even subsistence level gathering.
MODERN MECHANIZED FARMING IS SODOMY-TIER OFFENCE AGAINST THE ORDER OF NATURE. -
2021-06-25 at 2:22 PM UTC
Originally posted by aldra not even just water - modern mechanised farming practices use around 10x the energy (in fuel combustion) they produce (in food), it's an absurd situation
and all the petrochemicals they use from fertilizers to pesticides.
which is why ive always insisted that oil is the root cause of all evils. -
2021-06-25 at 2:24 PM UTC
Originally posted by vindicktive vinny
water is created from hydrogen, it is 66% hydrogen, and 34% hydrogen derivative.
and no, we arent discussing the genesis of water here.
we are talking about the adequatcy of water for everyones consumption.
when farmers irrigate their farm, they are actually going against the order of nature by forcing plants to grow where nature refused to let them grow. and they do so by robbing water supply from places and organisms nature intended them to live.
and the second imbalance caused by modern mechanized farming is that it sustain organisms that wouldnt have otherwise survived due to their inferiority and incompetency at even subsistence level gathering.
MODERN MECHANIZED FARMING IS SODOMY-TIER OFFENCE AGAINST THE ORDER OF NATURE.
Water is NOT created or destroyed on Earth by any natural process.
When farmers irrigate their land where do you think the water goes? back into the environment or into the fruits/veggies..which also eventually work their way back into the environment. -
2021-06-25 at 2:26 PM UTC
Originally posted by Donald Trump If you give these farmers in regions where water is scarce the room they will empty the rivers, the lakes, the aquifers, everything, leaving no water for anyone or anything else.
I'd probably do the same thing, fuck those assholes down-stream from me.
It's basically a tragedy-of-the-commons type scenario.
This is precisely why you can't have absolute property rights, and why good governance is needed. We need to conserve natural resources.
one of the most important source of drinkable water is ground water.
which could be rendered by law into becoming government property.
but having good governmence will not solve this predicament. because at then end of the day the government is still run by people, not saint. -
2021-06-25 at 2:29 PM UTC
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2021-06-25 at 2:35 PM UTC
Originally posted by Jiggaboo_Johnson
Water is NOT created or destroyed on Earth by any natural process.
When farmers irrigate their land where do you think the water goes? back into the environment or into the fruits/veggies..which also eventually work their way back into the environment.
how do you think trees grow and make wood.
yes, by drinking water.
water contains 2 atoms of hydrogen and 1 atom of oxygen. the tree drinks water, break the hydrogen and oxygen apart, fuse these 2 hydrogens with a carbon atom it sucked off from the air, and this new material become wood fibre.
do you know what science-aware people call firewoods ?
ja. hydrocarbons.
and when you burn these hydrocarbons break apart and become water, and oxides of carbon again.
such are the life cycles of water and hydrocarbons.
and its all el naturalidad. -
2021-06-25 at 2:36 PM UTCDesalination, it's a thing. Plenty of countries do it, primarily the curry flavored ones.
Lazy fucks living down stream and wanting free water can fuck off. They can MOVE somewhere else, move up stream of the farmers or die.
Damn freeloaders.
