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Bernie's $97 trillion
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2020-02-25 at 5:08 PM UTC
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2020-02-25 at 5:13 PM UTC
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2020-02-25 at 5:14 PM UTC
Originally posted by Obbe I don't think that's a real thing, if wealth is actually a representation of human labour his employees are just forced to give up most of the wealth their human labour generates to him.
Nobody is holding a gun to them. It is called a free market. Some people sell their labor low, some people sell it high, and the market pays the least it can for the most it can get. Just like you do when you spend your labor/money. -
2020-02-25 at 5:17 PM UTC
Originally posted by Speedy Parker Nobody is holding a gun to them. It is called a free market. Some people sell their labor low, some people sell it high, and the market pays the least it can for the most it can get. Just like you do when you spend your labor/money.
“Free market” is kind of a misnomer. They do have a metaphorical gun being held to them, the one that says they will starve to death if they don’t work to earn money. And all the people that PAY money do not offer a fair amount to 99% of their workers. It’s the illusion of choice, in reality almost all of us are slaves. The only real choice we have a say in is which slave owner we wantThe following users say it would be alright if the author of this post didn't die in a fire! -
2020-02-25 at 5:22 PM UTC
Originally posted by Speedy Parker Nobody is holding a gun to them. It is called a free market. Some people sell their labor low, some people sell it high, and the market pays the least it can for the most it can get. Just like you do when you spend your labor/money.
There's also such a thing as anti-trust, where corporations conspire together to corner the market and eliminate all competition through unethical and often illegal means. -
2020-02-25 at 5:30 PM UTC
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2020-02-25 at 5:31 PM UTC
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2020-02-25 at 5:32 PM UTCThe following users say it would be alright if the author of this post didn't die in a fire!
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2020-02-25 at 5:33 PM UTC
Originally posted by Fox They do have a metaphorical gun being held to them, the one that says they will starve to death if they don’t work to earn money.
Every organism in nature from a single celled whatever all the way up to man must toil to survive. The only "gun" is your own choice to live or die. If a wolf doesn't hunt with the pack it doesn't eat and it dies. Is that the packs fault? Should the pack just feed those members who are too lazy to make a meaningful contribution to the hunt just to be fair? That bad old greedy mean unfair pack!
Originally posted by Fox And all the people that PAY money do not offer a fair amount to 99% of their workers.
If you went to the store and saw cans of peaches selling at $20 cans for a dollar would you tell the cashier that price is not fair I need to pay you more? Of course not. So why would you pay more than you have to for anything else of value. Labor has value according to what is agreed upon by the seller and the buyer.
Originally posted by Fox It’s the illusion of choice, in reality almost all of us are slaves. The only real choice we have a say in is which slave owner we want
Or you can work for yourself and start a company like Jeff Bezos (He's a tard IMO for other reasons) and millions of others. Or you can be a contractor like hundreds of millions of others. It sounds to me like you don't have much confidence in your ability to survive outside of the "traditional" workplace.The following users say it would be alright if the author of this post didn't die in a fire! -
2020-02-25 at 5:35 PM UTCI hate to say this but I don’t respect your opinion enough to read all that
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2020-02-25 at 5:39 PM UTC
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2020-02-25 at 5:44 PM UTC
Originally posted by vindicktive vinny them how do you quantify labor ?
calloric expanses ?
I think people should be paid whatever value their labour generates. I don't believe a CEO is compensating his employees a fair value if he is able to squirrel away such an unimaginably vast wealth that couldn't even be spent in his lifetime, or even multiple lifetimes. And I do believe that wealth would be a lot more useful in the hands of the many workers who generated the wealth, who would stimulate the economy and live better quality lives if they were given the actual value of their labours, rather than hoarded away in the greedy hands of the few at the top.The following users say it would be alright if the author of this post didn't die in a fire! -
2020-02-25 at 5:54 PM UTC
Originally posted by Obbe I think people should be paid whatever value their labour generates. I don't believe a CEO is compensating his employees a fair value if he is able to squirrel away such an unimaginably vast wealth that couldn't even be spent in his lifetime, or even multiple lifetimes. And I do believe that wealth would be a lot more useful in the hands of the many workers who generated the wealth, who would stimulate the economy and live better quality lives if they were given the actual value of their labours, rather than hoarded away in the greedy hands of the few at the top.
The CEO is being compensated by the same people who compensate everyone else. They are called shareholders. They determine a CEO's value not you. -
2020-02-25 at 6:09 PM UTC
Originally posted by Obbe If you made $5,000 every single day, and worked every single day for 500 years, you would still not have as much money as Jeff Bezos - you wouldn't even have 1 billion.
Jeff Bezos must work a lot harder than you.
Run that through a compound interest calculator with basic index assumptions and tell me what you get. You’ll be surprised. -
2020-02-25 at 6:17 PM UTC
Originally posted by Ajax Run that through a compound interest calculator with basic index assumptions and tell me what you get. You’ll be surprised.
I’m just guessing but I don’t think it’s surprising to think even at 5% interest or something after 500 years you would have more money than there are grains of sand on earth. Which is of course impossible and thus it’s a meaningless number, it would never happen -
2020-02-25 at 6:54 PM UTC
Originally posted by Obbe I think people should be paid whatever value their labour generates.
how do you set the price of labor.
is 5000 kcal of work done by a wallstreet banker realy worth 50 million kilo callories of work done by §m£ÂgØLmamd his mexhicant ilk pickimg tomatoes ?
how do we determine a "fair" price of labor. supply amd demand system is clearly not a good way since it can be distorted by importine lesser humans to get the work done or exporting the work to be done elsewhere where calloric expanses are cheaper. -
2020-02-25 at 6:55 PM UTC
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2020-02-25 at 7:04 PM UTC
Originally posted by vindicktive vinny how do you set the price of labor.
is 5000 kcal of work done by a wallstreet banker realy worth 50 million kilo callories of work done by §m£ÂgØLmamd his mexhicant ilk pickimg tomatoes ?
how do we determine a "fair" price of labor. supply amd demand system is clearly not a good way since it can be distorted by importine lesser humans to get the work done or exporting the work to be done elsewhere where calloric expanses are cheaper.
I think the value of your labour is determined by what your labour produces. If you produce 1 loaf of bread a day, your labour that day is worth 1 loaf. If you make 60 loafs a day, your labour that day is worth 60 loafs. -
2020-02-25 at 7:20 PM UTC
Originally posted by Obbe I think the value of your labour is determined by what your labour produces. If you produce 1 loaf of bread a day, your labour that day is worth 1 loaf. If you make 60 loafs a day, your labour that day is worth 60 loafs.
that would be so if all those breads are meant exclusively for self consumption.
it only gets complicated when your trying to exchange it for some other labored goods.
say, cakes.
how many loaves of bread equals one cake ? -
2020-02-25 at 7:23 PM UTC
Originally posted by Obbe I think the value of your labour is determined by what your labour produces. If you produce 1 loaf of bread a day, your labour that day is worth 1 loaf. If you make 60 loafs a day, your labour that day is worth 60 loafs.
But who determines the value of a loaf of bread? And by the way who’s paying all these value-determiners?
